# Re: Dozenal chars in music

From: Thomas LAMBERT (thomas@lame-spirale.net)
Date: Tue May 19 2009 - 06:32:14 CDT

• Next message: Andreas Prilop: "Re: Dozenal chars in music"

Thank you all for your input.

Charlie :
⑩, ⑪ is not satisfying as i would like to add numbers, in dozenal : 7 + 7 =
12

But this is a tricky question, as even dozenal societies of great britain
and america have chosen different characters. At least 5 different notation
exists (see
- script X and a script E (not a bad choice but seems awkward in use)
- T and E (for Ten and Eleven which i found stupid because doz ten = dec
twelve, it just leads to confusions)
- A , B (which has not been chosen by any dozenal society)
- *, # (the worst in my opinion)
- rotated 2 to represent ten and a rotated or horizontally flipped 3 (Ꜫ) for
eleven (which i found quite nice but i did not found a rotated 2 in unicode.
Do you know if such a char exists ?)

Also i would like to add the counting constraint. IE : be able to count out
loud.
How do you pronouce A4 ?
"aty-four" sounds like eighty-four.
This is not like hexadecimal which is just used in a more compact
representation of binary : dozenal can be used to do math, and should be
used to do math given it's magic properties (here again, see Wikipedia
page).

So even if we take rotated 2 and 3, a vocal representation will have to be
invented, which i'm working on too but is obviously really subjective. If
your curious, for the moment it's "duc" for ð (with a french "u" ? that's
why ð looks kind like a d), and "las" for Ꜫ (it sounds like "last", and a
"S" sound for the last char creates a tension, which releases on the ten).
Try counting to twenty, it's hard ! ^^ Our brain cannot process the new gap
between 9 and 10

Again thanks for your interest. I was not sure at first that this was the
right place to post such a question, but i'm glad i did.

Thomas

2009/5/19 Mark E. Shoulson <mark@kli.org>

> Thomas LAMBERT wrote:
>
> Hello,
>>
>> I'm currently writing a web application for music theory, and in this app
>> (and in general in music) i would like to promote the use of the dozenal
>> (duodecimal) system, because it will make additions of intervals very easier
>>
>> For quite some time i've been roaming in unicode pages to find 2 perfects
>> characters to complete the decimal numbers with no luck.
>> Cause A and B reprensente notes in music, so i decided not to use them to
>> avoid confusion.
>> X and E are suggested too but roman numbers are also used in music to
>> represent chords relatively to a scale so X may be a bad choice.
>>
> I know the Dozenal Society also uses * and #, but that would be even more
> disastrous in music, given the importance of ♯.
>
>>
>> I was wondering if you had any advice for me ?
>> For example, one problem i come across is that the decimal number are
>> normalized in height, and i cannot find a char that COULD BE a number : they
>> always stand out (different baseline, different height). What code chart do
>> you suggest ?
>> Also they will have to be readable by any unicode implementation/font. Is
>> that a concern ?
>> Or should i just take letter to simplify ?
>>
>> Here is it what i found best : 123456789ðꜪ
>>
> I am pretty sure that this problem is outside the scope of this list,
> though it is fun to comb through the character list in search of interesting
> candidates (⑩, ⑪? Would look terrible, and confusing. You could use ɸ or
> something like it, which at least resembles a 1 and a 0... Good luck). But I
> think the Unicode community appreciates your intention to use existing
> characters in inventing your orthography, rather than making up another one
> we'd have to see in use and argue about.
>
> ~mark
>

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