[72906] MON 07/01/96 10:58 FROM V-SGREEN@MICROSOFT.COM "Steve Greenfield (Unicode)": UTC #69 Minutes (PART 1); 433 LINES Received: by rlg.org; Mon, 1 Jul 96 10:58:54 PDT Received: from abash1.microsoft.com by Unicode.ORG (NX5.67c/NX3.0M) id AA04738; Mon, 1 Jul 96 10:12:58 -0700 Received: by abash1.microsoft.com with Microsoft Exchange (IMC 4.0.838.14) id <01BB6735.1CE2BDD0@abash1.microsoft.com>; Mon, 1 Jul 1996 10:07:29 -0700 Message-Id: From: "Steve Greenfield (Unicode)" To: "'unicore@unicode.org'" Cc: "'unicode-inc@unicode.org'" , Mike Kernaghan , 'Joan Aliprand' Subject: UTC #69 Minutes (PART 1) Date: Mon, 1 Jul 1996 10:06:46 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.838.14 Encoding: 413 TEXT Here are the minutes to UTC #69. If there are any areas that require feedback, please let me know, and I will update my master copy. The main representatives of Corporate members will receive a hard-copy in the mail, too. If anyone else would like a hard-copy mailed to them, please send me a private e-mail with your address. Sincerely, Steve unicode-inc@unicode.org ================================ Unicode Technical Committee and X3L2 Joint Meeting UTC Meeting #69 X3L2 Meeting #167 Thursday, June 6, 1996 Friday, June 7, 1996 Redmond, WA Hosted by Microsoft Corporation Chair: Joan Aliprand; Vice-Chair: Arnold F. Winkler; Scribe: Steve Greenfield UTC Meeting convened at 1:38 p.m. Thursday, June 6, 1996 meeting I. Administrative Issues. A. UTC Membership Roll Call: Corporate Members: John Jenkins, Apple Computer, Inc. jenkins@apple.com (attended both days) Mike Ksar, Hewlett-Packard Company, ksar@hpcea.ce.hp.com (attended both days) Dr. V.S. Umamaheswaran, IBM Corporation, dorai@vnet.ibm.com (attended both days) Lisa Moore, IBM Corporation (Alternate), lisam@vnet.ibm.com (attended both days) Murray Sargent, Microsoft Corporation, murrays@microsoft.com (attended both days) Michel Suignard, Microsoft Corporation (Alternate), michelsu@microsoft.com (attended both days) Rick McGowan, NeXT Software, Inc., rick_mcgowan@next.com (attended both days) Gary Roberts, NCR, gary.roberts@elsegundoca.ncr.com (attended both days) Glenn Adams, Spyglass, Inc., glenn@spyglass.com (attended both days) Ken Whistler, Sybase, Inc., kenw@sybase.com (attended both days) Arnold Winkler, Unisys (X3L2 Chair & UTC Vice Chair), winkler@po3.bb.unisys.com (attended both days) Associate Members: Asmus Freytag, ASMUS, Inc., asmus_freytag@unicode.org (attended both days) Bob Sandstrom, University of Washington, sandstro@cac.washington.edu, (attended both days) Officer of the Consortium: Mike Kernaghan, Microsoft Corporation (Unicode, Inc. Vice President), mike_kernaghan@unicode.org (attended both days) X3L2 Member companies represented: Apple Computer; Hewlett-Packard; IBM; Microsoft; Unicode, Inc.; Unisys. Full (Corporate) Member companies represented: Apple, HP, IBM, Microsoft, NCR, NeXT, Spyglass, Sybase, Unisys. Full (Corporate) Member companies absent: Digital Equipment, Justsystem, MGI Software, Novell, RLG, SGI Arnold Winkler, opened the meeting with apologies for those members that could not make it to this meeting. Motion #69-1: Concern: 7 out of 15 members were present at the start of the meeting; was not a quorum. After a few late arrivals, we wound up having nine voting members. Members are asked to make every effort to attend meetings, and be on time. Adopted by Consensus B. Declaration of Joint Meeting: UTC Meeting called to order by Vice-Chair Arnold Winkler at 1:38 p.m. Mike Kernaghan offered to be co-chair of the UTC portion of the meeting. Arnold Winkler declared a Joint Meeting between X3L2 (#167) and the Unicode Technical Committee (UTC #69). C. Approval of Agenda of Joint Meeting [UTC#69 (1996-06-07) - 20]: There were several items added: I.D.2. Review of Action Items [UTC#69 (1996-06-07) - 22] II.G. Unicode Representation to WG2 and IRG Nominations. II.H. Proposal from John Jenkins III.K. Braille Proposal Discussion III.L. Armenian Proposal VII.C. EASC Report by John Jenkins IX.D. Addition of Quad Symbol for APL IX.E. Sorting Standards IX.F. Unicode property information and COBOL IX.G. APL Quad Symbol Proposal IX.H. UTF-16 D. Approval of Minutes from UTC #68: Page 5, last paragraph, strike all numbers pertaining to conference attendance. Remove people counts from Conference reports, page 5. Byzantine (MUSIC) Proposal Music should be added. The proper title was "The Byzantine Musical Notation Proposal". Vice-Chair Winkler asked for a vote for approval of the Minutes (as amended). Motion #69-2: That the minutes be approved as amended. Moved by Ken Whistler, seconded by Rick McGowan Unanimous vote Minutes approved (with editorial changes) Future formatting of Minutes: Add boxes or highlight action items and resolutions (motions). Action Items and Motions will be assigned numbers for reference purposes. Action Item #69-A1: Steve Greenfield Future numbering of any action items should be numbered with their UTC #, and have sufficient content to allow anyone to follow what was being requested. For excellent examples, refer to X3L2 and WG2 documentation. A similar numbering system should be used to note Motions passed by the UTC. Action Item #69-A2: UTC Chair The Chair of all UTC meetings has been asked not assign numbers to documents without having control over the document. This requires the papers to have been turned in to the Chair prior to each meeting. When this requirement has been met, then that document is added to the group of papers and assigned a number. It is then assigned a place on the agenda for discussion/review. E. Document Registration: X3L2 Documents X3L2/96-033 US response to WG2 resolution 29.10 at the meeting in Tokyo Suignard US position 96-04-17 396-D X3L2/96-034 US position concerning the referenced proposal to encode the Cherokee script Suignard US position 96-04-17 396-D X3L2/96-035 Revised proposal concerning inclusion into 10646 of the repertoire of Runic characters Wera Lundstrom 96-03-13 396-D X3L2/96-036 ISO/IEC DISP 11186-2: ISP FVT311 - Repertoire assignment Type for ISO 10646 and JT/96-0163 J for ballot DISP 11186-2 JT/96-0163 J April 1996 396-D X3L2/96-037 An operational model for characters and glyphs Ed Hart 96-04-14 1141-L X3L2/96-038 Resolutions from the SC2/WG2 meeting in Copenhagen, April 1996 SC2/WG2 N1354 SC2 N2683 96-04-26 admin X3L2/96-039 Resolutions of the 9th JTC1 meeting in Sydney, March 11-15, 1996 JTC1 N4058 SC2 N2676 96-03-15 admin X3L2/96-040 Relations ISO/IEC JTC1 with ISO/TC46, a comment Johan van Wingen SC2 N2681 96-03-07 admin X3L2/96-041 ISO/IEC 10646-1:1993, Technical Corrigendum 1 SC2 N2687 96-02-15 396-D X3L2/96-042 Summary of voting on NWI for "An operational model for characters and glyphs JTC1 N4062 SC2 N2677 96-04-03 1141-L X3L2/96-043 Call for candidates to serve as registration authority for ISO 2375 and ISO 7350 SC2 N2685 May 1996 admin X3L2/96-044 Call for candidates to serve as chairman for ISO/IEC JTC1/SC2 SC2 N2684 May 1996 admin X3L2/96-045 Call for candidates to serve as secretariat for ISO/IEC JTC1/SC2 JTC1 N4082 SC2 N2678 96-04-17 admin X3L2/96-046 1st draft agenda for 6th plenary of JTC1/SC2 in Quebec, August 20-21, 1996 SC2 N2686 May 1996 admin X3L2/96-047 Ballot for pDAM #9 to ISO/IEC 10646-1 - Identifiers for characters Winkler 96-05-20 admin X3L2/96-048 pDAM #9 to ISO/IEC 10646-1 - Identifiers for characters SC2 N2674 April 1996 admin X3L2/96-049 SC2/WG2 summary and status of proposals SC2/WG2 N1302 96-04-26 396-D X3L2/96-050 Publication schedule for amendments and revisions of 10646- proposal SC2/WG2 N1328 96-03-03 396-D X3L2/96-051 Runic script - update SC2/WG2 N1382 96-04-18 396-D X3L2/96-052 Latest update of standaing document on principles and procedures for allocation of new characters and scripts SC2/WG2 N1352 96-04-26 396-D X3L2/96-053 Proposal for addition of Latin characters - Romania SC2/WG2 N1361 95-04-22 396-D X3L2/96-054 Mongolian script proposal China/Mongolia SC2/WG2 N1368 96-04-10 396-D X3L2/96-055 Ad hoc report on Mongolian script - Copenhagen meeting SC2/WG2 N1383 96-04-25 396-D X3L2/96-056 Informal report on WG2 meeting in Copenhagen Michel Suignard 96-06-06 396-D X3L2/96-057 Proposed Motion of Japanese comments on JTC1 N3745 Hart & Griffee 96-06-05 1141-L X3L2/96-058 U.S. request for WG2 on C/G model U.S. 96-06-04 1141-L X3L2/96-059 Proposal for addition of four Cyrillic characters Republic of Macedonia 96-05-30 396-D X3L2/96-060 Khmer X3L2/96-061 Burmese X3L2/96-062 Sinhala X3L2/96-063 Canadian proposal from Uma X3L2/96-064 Armenian X3L2/96-065 Simple Unicode text compression Mark Davis 96-06-06 396-D ISO documents N 1302 SC2/WG2 summary & status of proposals Thygesen N 1328 Publication schedule for Amendments & revision of ISO/IEC 10646 Paterson N 1330 Revised proposal concerning inclusion into ISO/IEC 10646 of the Repertoire of Runic Characters Lundstrom N 1352 Principles and procedures for allocation of new characters and scripts (Revised N 1116) and handling of defect reports on character names (Revised N 1137) Umamaheswaran/ Thygesen/Edberg N 1354 Resolutions of WG2 meeting 30 N 1361 Proposal for additional Latin characters Costake/Statescu/ Matei N 1368 Joint proposal draft on encoding Mongolian character set N 1372 Update on WG2 N 1270 and WG2 N 1326 on Ethiopic Ross N 1382 Runic Script: Description and proposed character name table N 1383 Initial comments on encoding Mongolian into ISO/IEC 10646 UTC Documents UTC #69 (1996-06-07) - 20 Agenda For Joint Meeting UTC #69 & X3L2 #167 Aliprand/Greenfield UTC #69 (1996-06-07) - 21 UTC #68 Minutes Aliprand/Greenfield UTC #69 (1996-06-07) - 22 UTC #68 Action Item List Greenfield UTC #69 (1996-06-07) - 23 Source Code Separation Rule Hart UTC #69 (1996-06-07) - 24 Michael Everson Response to SOAS Everson UTC #69 (1996-06-07) - 25 Conclusive Proposal for Encoding Ethiopic Syllabary Becker F. Calendar Review: Calendar of Meetings: WG2 Schedule: Meeting # 31 12 - 16 August 1996 Quebec City, Quebec, Canada Meeting # 32 20 - 24 January 1997 Singapore, Singapore Meeting # 33 Summer 1997 Cyprus, Cyprus IRG Schedule: IRG #7 24 - 28 June 1996 Hong Kong, HK X3L2 Schedule: X3L2 #168 Dec. 5 - 6, 1996 San Diego, CA (hosted by NCR) UTC Schedule: UTC #70 Sept. 7, 1996 San Jose, CA (at the Red Lion Inn) UTC #71 Dec. 5 - 6, 1996 San Diego, CA (hosted by NCR) UTC #72 March 7, 1997 San Francisco (hosted by SHARE) Other Organizations' Schedules: WG3 19 - 20 August 1996 Quebec City, Quebec, Canada SC2 21 - 22 August 1996 Quebec City, Quebec, Canada SC2 23 - 27 Sept. 1996 London, UK SC22/WG20 9 - 13 Sept. 1996 Vienna, Austria SC22/WG20 12 - 16 May 1997 Quebec, Canada SC22/WG20 Fall 1997 Egypt SHARE Meeting March 2 - 7, 1997 San Francisco, CA International Unicode Conference: IUC #9 Sept. 4 - 6, 1996 San Jose, CA For UTC #72; SHARE, Inc. offered meeting facilities for either March 6 or 7. If this is acceptable, then a letter from Unicode should be sent to SHARE, Inc. informing them that the UTC would like to hold a meeting and that facilities should be made available. Action Item #69-A3: Arnold Winkler Arnold is to contact Ed Hart and let him know that the UTC accepts SHARE's offer to host UTC #72. The UTC prefers Friday, March 7, 1997. UTC #70: Unicode Technical Committee #70 is scheduled for Saturday, September 7, and will be at the Red Lion Inn, San Jose, California. This is to accommodate those people attending the IUC #9. Action Item #69-A4: Asmus Freytag Contact Barbara Jarzyna, of GMS, Inc. about holding UTC #70 at the Red Lion Inn and the cost. He is to let the officers know via e-mail. Action Item #69-A5: Steve Greenfield Update Calendar of Events on agenda template. Action Item #69-A6: Ken Whistler, Joan Aliprand, and Mike Kernaghan Check into the availability of their facilities for UTC #70. (Made moot by use of Red Lion Inn.) G. Unicode Representation to IRG and WG2 Meetings: Asmus Freytag, the Unicode Liaison Representative to WG2, will be unavailable during the August Quebec meeting, WG2 Meeting #31. Glenn Adams was nominated by John Jenkins as the alternate Unicode liaison representative to WG2. Vice-Chair Winkler asked for a vote for approval of Glenn Adams as the Unicode Liaison to the WG2 meeting to be held in Quebec City, Quebec, Canada on August 12-16, 1996. Motion #69-3: Glenn Adams is nominated as Liaison to WG2 for Meeting #31. Moved by John Jenkins, seconded by Asmus Freytag Unanimous vote Glenn Adams approved as Liaison Representative to WG2. Unicode representation to IRG: Vice-Chair Winkler asked for a vote for approval of John Jenkins as the Primary Unicode Consortium representative to the IRG meeting to be held in Hong Kong, June 24-28, 1996. Motion #69-4: John Jenkins is nominated as Primary Representative to IRG for the Unicode Consortium. Moved by Asmus Freytag, seconded by Glenn Adams Unanimous vote John Jenkins approved as Primary Representative to IRG. Action Item #69-A7: John Jenkins/Mark Davis John Jenkins is to write a letter (for Mark Davis, as President of Unicode, Inc., to sign) to Mr. Zhong stating Unicode, Inc.'s acceptance of John Jenkins as the primary representative to the IRG. Action Item #69-A8: John Jenkins The letter, stating Unicode, Inc.'s acceptance of John Jenkins as the primary representative to the IRG and written by John Jenkins, is to be cc'd to Mike Ksar. H. Proposal by John Jenkins: John Jenkins would like to have all future documents (X3L2 and UTC) be in HTML format. There was heavy discussion on the topic with the majority of participants voicing opinions on security, submission of documents, electronic archiving abilities, retrieval of documentation, maintenance of paper distribution, and implementation towards this goal. Having hard-copies available is a time-tested, and proven, method of distribution. The UTC decided that it would be possible, with Glenn Adams providing a secure server, but should be started in small steps; not all at once. Action Item #69-A9: Glenn Adams Glenn will take on making the security of document access through a secure server; depositing documents (through file uploading) through password access; set up a web conferencing ability (will allow recorded archives). Arnold Winkler presented several ideas concerning electronic media: Substitution vs. augmentation. He agreed that there should be greater use of electronic media, but that it should be used in controlled, and well-documented, stages. Once this situation exists, the Chair of the UTC can then promote the use of this media to the people submitting papers. The submitters would be encouraged to use the new technology. This would only be a back-up to the current system in use; the paper trail. The Chair will make the final decision on acceptance of format. Michel Suignard also pointed out the possibility of using links for documents (by providing "viewers".) Action Item #69-A10: Arnold Winkler Provide information to Glenn Adams about the problems SC22/WG20 has discovered with the distribution of documents. II. Interaction with WG2. A. Reports and documents from WG2: 1. Report from IR (Michel Suignard) and Unicode Liaison (Asmus Freytag) Asmus Freytag reported on the WG2 meeting in Copenhagen. There was a discussion on the advantages and disadvantages of the DAM process of adding new characters and scripts. The alternative was to wait for ISO/IEC 10646 to be published in 1998. The argument against waiting was due to "mature" scripts and characters being kept in limbo too long. The "buckets" should be emptied every six months. This will allow the Unicode Standard to move forward as well. 2. N 1354 Resolutions from WG2 meeting in Copenhagen - [X3L2/96-038] Action Item #69-A11: Steve Greenfield Add the current listing of WG2 Meetings to Calendar of Events portion of Agenda template. Document X3L2/96-056 lists what was going on, rather than detailing the total meeting. The Consortium should express a position statement concerning the 4 Cyrillic characters proposed by Macedonia. This statement will be used by the Unicode Liaison at the next WG2 meeting in Quebec (August 96). The statement should express acceptance and proposed character location (as requested by WG2). Listing of different Resolutions: M30.8: Glyph for Object Replacement Character from UTC/X3L2 is needed. John Jenkins is to ask Mark Davis to add this font (box with OBJ in it). Resolution reached about fonts. M30.11: IRG vertical extensions; comments on N 1359 and N 1379 are requested from the NB before IRG meeting in June 1996. M30.12: IRG horizontal extensions N 1358; were the source-code separation rules applied properly? See Ed Hart's comments on pDAM 8 for further reference material. M30.14: No changes can be accepted. M30.15: Mongolian ad hoc meeting in Beijing (August 96); the US expressed interest in attending the meeting, but requires an official invitation. Action Item #69-A12: Steve Greenfield Minutes should include any action items generated from the WG2 meetings so that X3L2 and UTC action items are listed for double reference. 3. N 1352 Principles and procedures for allocation of new characters and scripts [X3L2/96-052] This document was provided as FYI material. 4. N 1302 WG2 summary and status of proposals [X3L2/96-049] This document was provided as FYI material. 5. N 1352 Proposal; Publication schedule for amendments and revisions of 10646 [X3L2/96-050] This document was provided as FYI material so that members are still aware of what is going on within WG2. No decision is needed from the UTC at this time. B. Input for next WG2 Meeting. 1. pDAM and DAM Review There was consensus that pDAM 5-7 are in synch with what the Unicode Consortium is going to publish in Version 2.0. Vice-chair Winkler asked for a vote for approval of DAM's 1-7 and Corrigenda 1. Motion #69-5: The UTC reaffirms its approval of the publication of the Unicode Standard, Version 2.0 which the UTC feels satisfactorily matches 10646 including DAMs 1-7 and corrigenda 1. Moved by Asmus Freytag, seconded by John Jenkins. Unanimous vote Motion approved. 2. pDAM 8, Informative annex on CJK ideographs Discussion was deferred. 3. pDAM 9, Unique identifiers [96-048] The chair reminded X3L2 members of the importance of voting and asked that the participants in X3L2 know the deadlines for each ballot. They should be addressed to Arnold Winkler. Meeting Adjourned at 5:55 p.m.