Re: The glyph of the CAPITAL SHARP S

From: Asmus Freytag (
Date: Thu May 10 2007 - 12:04:10 CDT

  • Next message: Philippe Verdy: "RE: The glyph of the CAPITAL SHARP S"

    On 5/10/2007 1:26 AM, Michael Everson wrote:
    > At 22:46 -0700 2007-05-09, John Hudson wrote:
    >> Rather than a lot of non-Germans and people who are not type
    >> designers or typographers making suggestions about what this German
    >> character should look like, it seems to me that the DIN should have a
    >> competition to design the model form for inclusion in standards glyph
    >> charts and identify acceptable variations selected by a jury of
    >> German designers and publishers. These are, after all, the people who
    >> will be using this thing.
    > I speak German, John. Lots of people who are not German speak German.
    > Great-great grandfather was German. Does that count?
    Sorry, not necessarily. It's probably not a bad background from which to
    contribute to the overall question but not ideal for some aspects.

    I think you'd very likely make a poor test subject where the question is
    "which of these designs is the more readable/more natural to the average
    German reader". That is, not unless you actively read large amounts of
    material typeset in German with speeds of that of a native reader. And
    even then, your personal recognition system, having had to digest all
    the different scripts that you are working on so intimately, has been so
    broadened, that you are now 'above average'.
    > I think that on the Unicode list we do have a good mix of "na´ve"
    > German users as well as a number of people who are involved in type
    > design or typography. This is not a bad place to discuss the matter or
    > to review my PDF attempts to improve what goes on the ballot.
    I entirely agree with that. Given that it is a large, open list, it also
    includes many that have not kept up with the early stages of the
    >> Since Linotype, as a German company, is the font publisher that is
    >> most likely to be affected by the encoding of this character, and who
    >> will be under the most pressure, if use of the character becomes
    >> widespread, to add support for it to their library, it seems to me
    >> that inviting their input on the design would be a sensible move for
    >> DIN.
    > Your idea is fine, but at the end of the day it falls to me to draw
    > the glyph that goes in the charts, and it is expected to harmonize
    > with the rest of the glyphs. And the UCS is an International Standard,
    > not just a DIN standard.
    At the end of the day, you may be the one supplying the actual outline,
    but it falls to the community to settle the overall features of what
    would be a proper Times-like design appropriate for the code charts. I
    read your statement not as claiming ownership, but to remind people that
    the decision for the representative glyph has to be settled way before
    wide-spread implementations of this glyph become available (excepting
    the pre-existing fonts here for a moment).


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