Re: [OpenType] PS glyph `phi' vs `phi1'

From: Werner LEMBERG (
Date: Sat Feb 22 2003 - 02:33:54 EST

  • Next message: Jungshik Shin: "Re: UTF-8 Editors? (Was XML and tags)"

    > >Show me a widely used font which contains both U+03C6 and U+03D5.
    > That was not the issue. The issue is when font wanted to add 03D5
    > that they would not just put the opposite glyph into 03D5. Or just
    > end up having a duplicate glyph. Fonts that have 03D5 by their
    > nature should be intended for use with technical publishing and
    > therefore are not (as) free in their choice of glyph for 03C6 as
    > pure text fonts are.

    OK, let me formulate my provocative question differently:

      Show me a widely used (technical) font which contains the Unicode
      3.0 shape of U+03D5.

    I really wonder that no major font company has ever addressed this
    problem publicly (at least this issue has never been discussed on the
    OpenType list AFAIK) -- Unicode 3.0 is out since a long time...

    Here my proposal to partly fix the problem. It won't help for
    pre-Unicode 3.0 documents but it should enable software to use older
    fonts which use Adobe Glyph Names with recent Unicode.

      . Adobe should fix the mapping in AGL's `glyphlist.txt' since the
        AGL identifies glyph shapes. Thus `phi' is the stroked glyph and
        `phi1' the curly version. I'm referring to Adobe's `Symbol' font
        version 001.007 -- most PS printers have this font built in.

          phi 03D5
          phi1 03C6

      . The annotation to U+03D5 should not refer to the AGL entity `phi1'
        but to `phi' (and something similar should be added to U+03C6).

      . If both PS glyph names `phi' and `phi1' are available in a single
        font, the software should rely on them instead of mapping Unicode
        code points to glyph indices directly. Otherwise proceed as

      . In the OpenType specification, the `post' table should get a new
        version 3.1 (or something similar) to indicate the use of Unicode
        3.0 and newer for glyph shapes. Alternatively, a new GSUB
        feature called `uni3' which flips the two glyph shapes could be
        added. [This is a weak point. Any better ideas how to mark an
        OpenType font to be compliant with Unicode 3.0?]

    Given the fact (as shown in another mail from Raymond) that most fonts
    haven't been updated to the Unicode 3.0 glyph shapes of phi I can
    imagine that my proposal greatly reduces the number of incorrect
    displays of U+03C6 and U+03D5.


    This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Sat Feb 22 2003 - 04:58:48 EST