Re: French accented letters (was: Re: Monetary decimal separators)

From: Antoine Leca (
Date: Fri Sep 23 2005 - 07:25:58 CDT

  • Next message: Philippe Verdy: "Re: French accented letters (was: Re: Monetary decimal separators)"

    On Thursday, September 22nd, 2005 18:19Z Philippe Verdy wrote:

    > On Tue, 20 Sep 2005, Antoine Leca wrote:
    >> A widely different yet possible explanation is that on the 437
    >> codepage (as on any PC screen on boot), the only French
    >> "extended" capitals were Æ, Ü and É; the Æ digraph and Ü
    >> are very uncommon, so it may explain also the rule.
    > You forget other extended capital letters needed for French:

    No. But you forgot to read what I wrote.

    I acknowledge I forgot Ç. I apologize for that, I should have known better.
    It does not change the point, since it is also uncommon.

    > - 'Â', 'Ê', 'Î', 'Ô', 'Û' : all of them can be composed with the
    > standard French keyboard,

    Just try under codepage 437 (a standard PC, using plain basic DOS; _without_
    DISPLAY.SYS and the bloated magic inserted by the latter versions of MS-DOS,
    just the KEYBFR or KEYB FR driver.)
    Then you can come back to comment about it.

    > - 'Ä', 'Ë', 'Ï', 'Ö', 'Ÿ', in addition to 'Ü' already listed by you,

    I am not aware that Ä or Ö are used in "official" French (considering your
    words about Ñ). And about Ÿ, well your mileage may vary a lot here, there
    are a lot of keyboard layouts which do not allow you to type it.

    > (note that Ÿ is extremely rare, occuring only on rare French proper
    > names when written in all-capitals style;

    Of course, Ü or Ù are much more common.

    > - 'Ç' : can't be composed with any widely available driver,

    Give a try to Option and the ç key. ;-)

    > but 'ç' can be composed with a simple single keystroke

    And the point is?

    > - 'æ' and 'Æ' digraph ligatures are part of French, but used only for
    > pedantic/scientific Latin words. They are not supported by standard
    > drivers,

    Just press Option A (with the shift key if you want the uppercase). It is
    even logical!

    > - 'œ' and 'Œ' digraph ligatures are part of the normal and common
    > French orthography, but not composable in any widely available
    > driver.

    Again, the most obvious way works: Option and O, along with the shift key if
    you want uppercase.

    > Conclusion: ISO-8859-15 and Windows 1252 both have all the necessary
    > characters for French.

    Which have absolutely nothing to do with my original point you quoted.
    Congratulations and many thanks for the lesson^H^H^H^H^H^Hdissertation.

    > There's no reason to not map the only two missing (and very frequent)
    > French capital letters 'É', 'Ç' on the French keyboard. Optionally a
    > French keyboard should support 'œ'/'Œ', and could (possibly) support
    > 'æ'/'Æ' but there's much less need.

    I agree about Æ, but saying there is use for Ç and less need for œ is...
    funny to say the least. LOL.


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