Re: ISO 15924 and differences in French names of scripts

From: Antoine Leca (
Date: Wed Oct 26 2005 - 05:07:55 CST

  • Next message: Chris Harvey: "Re: ISO 15924 and differences in French names of scripts"

    Denis Jacquerye wrote:
    > The recommanded orthography of 1990 allows both 'i' or 'u' with
    > circumflex to be substituted with 'i' or 'u' without when there is no
    > ambiguity. Both the old orthography and the 1990 one are correct but
    > of course the one without circumflex on i or u is recommanded.


    > This diffrence "bengalî", "bengali" is simply old vs 1990 orthography.

    The difference is probably older. The 9th edition of the dictionnary from
    /Académie française/ already losts the accent (and I did not take the time
    to search earlier editions.) Note that « bengali » seems special here.

    On the other hand, "Beng"=bengâ*g*lî in is definitively wrong!

    > The French locale in CLDR itself contains this disagreement of
    > orthography. In we
    > have "Iles d'Åland" but "Îles Cocos".

    The 1990 recommandations are not intented for proper nouns. The official
    text explicitely explains (p.13) that « Nîmes » (a city in Southern France),
    as well as « nîmois » (the adjective qualifying its inhabitants) ought to
    keep the accent.

    This strives the problems to decide if « Iles » is part of the name or is
    just a capitalized substantive.

    You may hint that the toponymic rules say that in the first case it is a
    common noun (so drops the accent), because of the copulative « de », while
    in the second it is part of the proper noun (so keeps the accent). However,
    every set of rules (IGN, UNGEGN) I found, consistently explain that accents
    are to be preserved : even « Île-de-France » (for the Americans, it is the
    county of Paris, sort of) keeps its accent in the recent reform of the

    Bottom line, I believe « Iles d'Åland » ought to be corrected to « Îles
    d'Åland ». BTW, it is the only "territory" which does not have the accent;
    also it is not listed officially by UNO.

    Similarly there are some capitals or accents lacking: « VA=Saint-Siège
    (*E*tat de la Cité du Vatican) », « KYD=dollar des *î*les Caïmans », «
    MUR=roupie de l’*î*le Maurice ». OTOH we have « UM=Îles *M*ineures
    *É*loignées des États-Unis » which looks imperfect. Etc.

    Unfortunately, I do not have the necessary authority at this point of the
    research to "suggest" changes, the list is supposed to have been revised by
    the relevant authorities (whatever they are.) So I assume it is worth
    nothing to post a bug report about this.

    Also, the recommandations explain that CDLR is not trying to follow
    _official_ usage (like Confœderation helvetica), but rather customary
    practice (Switzerland).
    This might justify to apply your change (dropping acents) uniformly, since
    the most general usage in France is to drop the accent on « Île(s) ».


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