Latin chi and stretched x

From: Denis Jacquerye <>
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2012 04:14:32 +0200


There are some issues with the stretched x that has been accepted from
N4081 (Revised proposal to encode “Teuthonista” phonetic characters in
the UCS) and N4106 (Teuthonista ad hoc report) and the proposed Latin
chi from N4262 (Proposal to encode “Unifon” and other characters in
the UCS).
According to Michael Everson stretch x and Latin chi are different
strictly speaking, because of their shape and difference in weight of
diagonals – stretched x has the \ diagonal thicker than the /
diagonal, while the API Latin chi has the / diagonal thicker than the
\ diagonal (like Greek chi). Although this is true. I don't believe
these are clearly different glyphs, I seriously doubt this makes them
different characters or that there is any evidence supporting such

1. The two stretched x used in Sprachatlas von Bayerisch-Swaben (SBS)
and Sprachatlas von Unterfranken (SMF) which are not the same glyphs
strictly speaking represent the same sound represented with chi (Greek
glyph) in other works using Teuthonista.
1.1 The stretched x used in those example are either in italic form
(SBS), which is identical to Lepsius's chi, or in sans serif form
(SMF), which is no different than some sans serif Greek chi except
that it is taller than x-height instead of below the baseline.
1.2 The stretched x used in Gabriel 1985 Einführung in den
Vorarlberger Sprachatlas (VALTS) is actually the glyph of Greek chi.
2. The capital Latin chi proposed in N4262 is actually based on
evidence of Lepsius's chi which has a different shape strictly
speaking than the one proposed. In other words, the proposed glyph has
no evidence of use.

Since those glyphs represents the same sounds (within works using
Teuthonista) or very similar sounds, and never co-occur should they
not be unified?

Lepsius Roman and italic Chi.png
from Zeitschrift für ägyptische Sprache und Altertumskunde (1868)
-- Lepsius' roman and italic capital chi are not the same as proposed capital

Teuthonista 1965-Wiesinger.jpg
from Teuthonista 1965
-- Teuthonista's chi is using Greek chi's glyph

N4081 - König 1997 - stretched x.png
from SBS
-- italic stretched x, almost identical to Lepsius italic chi.

N4081 - Gabriel 1985 - stretched x.png
from Einführung in den Vorarlberger Sprachatlas
-- this example of stretched x (letter and modifier letter) in N4081
is the same glyph as Greek chi.

N4081 - SMF 2.2 - stretch x
from SMF 2.2
-- this example of stretched x in N4081 is taller than x-height but
similar to Greek chi in some sans serif fonts.

N4262 - comparison with unseen Latin capital chi.png
-- This comparison in N4262 gives Latin letter capital x, Latin letter
small x, Latin letter small stretched x ~ Greek letter capital chi,
Greek letter small chi ~ proposed Latin letter capital chi, proposed
Latin letter small chi. However the Roman examples of stretched x in
N4081 are taller than x-height and not below baseline, the Italic
examples are like Greek chi or like Lepsius's chi. Furthermore, the
proposed Latin letter capital chi has no actual examples (stricly
speaking with glyph -- only Lepsius' capital chi has been used

Denis Moyogo Jacquerye

Lepsius_Roman_and_italic_Chi.png Teuthonista_1964-Wiesinger.jpg N4081_-_Ko__nig_1997_-_stretched_x.png N4081_-_Gabriel_1985_-_stretched_x.png N4081_-_SMF_2.2_-_stretch_x.png N4262_-_comparison_with_unseen_Latin_capital_chi.png
Received on Sun Jun 03 2012 - 21:23:25 CDT

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